Why don't Democrats and Republicans collude together?
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This question is true for any 2-party system.
My question stems from Why don't China, Russia, USA and EU establish complete world dominance?.
Why don't Democrats and Republicans collude together to establish a total and perpetual control on the country?
What makes them not to do that? Is there any explanation other than Prisoner's dilemma?
Note. I am not fluent in US political/electoral structure.
united-states parties
 |Â
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up vote
14
down vote
favorite
This question is true for any 2-party system.
My question stems from Why don't China, Russia, USA and EU establish complete world dominance?.
Why don't Democrats and Republicans collude together to establish a total and perpetual control on the country?
What makes them not to do that? Is there any explanation other than Prisoner's dilemma?
Note. I am not fluent in US political/electoral structure.
united-states parties
10
How do you wish "collude" to be interpreted? E.g. there are several states with election laws which treat the major parties differently from other parties and individuals. Does that count as collusion, or does it need to be less accidental than that?
â origimbo
2 days ago
33
What do you mean by "total and perpetual dominance of the country"? Those two political parties have dominated Congress and the Presidency for well over a century, so it seems like their job is already done. Are you more asking why they don't work together to pass legislation that outright makes other parties illegal?
â Giter
2 days ago
5
Why would they need to? It is already locked into a two party system with them in control for the most part
â Joe W
2 days ago
7
How do you know they're not colluding? In fact both parties have recently had major campaigns by anti-establishment candidates (Sanders (D) and Trump (R)) that were largely premised on the claim that the elected officials of both parties ("the establishment") were in fact in cahoots.
â Joe
2 days ago
11
They do. Most bills are passed with bipartisan and often unanimous support, although a modest subset are partisan and/or controversial. Democrats and Republicans combined have had total control of the country since the late 19th century.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago
 |Â
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up vote
14
down vote
favorite
up vote
14
down vote
favorite
This question is true for any 2-party system.
My question stems from Why don't China, Russia, USA and EU establish complete world dominance?.
Why don't Democrats and Republicans collude together to establish a total and perpetual control on the country?
What makes them not to do that? Is there any explanation other than Prisoner's dilemma?
Note. I am not fluent in US political/electoral structure.
united-states parties
This question is true for any 2-party system.
My question stems from Why don't China, Russia, USA and EU establish complete world dominance?.
Why don't Democrats and Republicans collude together to establish a total and perpetual control on the country?
What makes them not to do that? Is there any explanation other than Prisoner's dilemma?
Note. I am not fluent in US political/electoral structure.
united-states parties
edited yesterday
agc
3,2441241
3,2441241
asked 2 days ago
anonymous
8431720
8431720
10
How do you wish "collude" to be interpreted? E.g. there are several states with election laws which treat the major parties differently from other parties and individuals. Does that count as collusion, or does it need to be less accidental than that?
â origimbo
2 days ago
33
What do you mean by "total and perpetual dominance of the country"? Those two political parties have dominated Congress and the Presidency for well over a century, so it seems like their job is already done. Are you more asking why they don't work together to pass legislation that outright makes other parties illegal?
â Giter
2 days ago
5
Why would they need to? It is already locked into a two party system with them in control for the most part
â Joe W
2 days ago
7
How do you know they're not colluding? In fact both parties have recently had major campaigns by anti-establishment candidates (Sanders (D) and Trump (R)) that were largely premised on the claim that the elected officials of both parties ("the establishment") were in fact in cahoots.
â Joe
2 days ago
11
They do. Most bills are passed with bipartisan and often unanimous support, although a modest subset are partisan and/or controversial. Democrats and Republicans combined have had total control of the country since the late 19th century.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago
 |Â
show 3 more comments
10
How do you wish "collude" to be interpreted? E.g. there are several states with election laws which treat the major parties differently from other parties and individuals. Does that count as collusion, or does it need to be less accidental than that?
â origimbo
2 days ago
33
What do you mean by "total and perpetual dominance of the country"? Those two political parties have dominated Congress and the Presidency for well over a century, so it seems like their job is already done. Are you more asking why they don't work together to pass legislation that outright makes other parties illegal?
â Giter
2 days ago
5
Why would they need to? It is already locked into a two party system with them in control for the most part
â Joe W
2 days ago
7
How do you know they're not colluding? In fact both parties have recently had major campaigns by anti-establishment candidates (Sanders (D) and Trump (R)) that were largely premised on the claim that the elected officials of both parties ("the establishment") were in fact in cahoots.
â Joe
2 days ago
11
They do. Most bills are passed with bipartisan and often unanimous support, although a modest subset are partisan and/or controversial. Democrats and Republicans combined have had total control of the country since the late 19th century.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago
10
10
How do you wish "collude" to be interpreted? E.g. there are several states with election laws which treat the major parties differently from other parties and individuals. Does that count as collusion, or does it need to be less accidental than that?
â origimbo
2 days ago
How do you wish "collude" to be interpreted? E.g. there are several states with election laws which treat the major parties differently from other parties and individuals. Does that count as collusion, or does it need to be less accidental than that?
â origimbo
2 days ago
33
33
What do you mean by "total and perpetual dominance of the country"? Those two political parties have dominated Congress and the Presidency for well over a century, so it seems like their job is already done. Are you more asking why they don't work together to pass legislation that outright makes other parties illegal?
â Giter
2 days ago
What do you mean by "total and perpetual dominance of the country"? Those two political parties have dominated Congress and the Presidency for well over a century, so it seems like their job is already done. Are you more asking why they don't work together to pass legislation that outright makes other parties illegal?
â Giter
2 days ago
5
5
Why would they need to? It is already locked into a two party system with them in control for the most part
â Joe W
2 days ago
Why would they need to? It is already locked into a two party system with them in control for the most part
â Joe W
2 days ago
7
7
How do you know they're not colluding? In fact both parties have recently had major campaigns by anti-establishment candidates (Sanders (D) and Trump (R)) that were largely premised on the claim that the elected officials of both parties ("the establishment") were in fact in cahoots.
â Joe
2 days ago
How do you know they're not colluding? In fact both parties have recently had major campaigns by anti-establishment candidates (Sanders (D) and Trump (R)) that were largely premised on the claim that the elected officials of both parties ("the establishment") were in fact in cahoots.
â Joe
2 days ago
11
11
They do. Most bills are passed with bipartisan and often unanimous support, although a modest subset are partisan and/or controversial. Democrats and Republicans combined have had total control of the country since the late 19th century.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago
They do. Most bills are passed with bipartisan and often unanimous support, although a modest subset are partisan and/or controversial. Democrats and Republicans combined have had total control of the country since the late 19th century.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago
 |Â
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9 Answers
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up vote
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I mean, we've had exclusively Democrat or Republican governments for well over 150 years, I'm not sure how else you'd measure "total and perpetual dominance".
10
~150 out of last 242 years to be exact for the two existing parties. At a rate around 61.2% of the entire history of the US belonging to these two parties, it's hard to quantify it as anything but total dominance.
â Anoplexian
2 days ago
1
"We have always been at war with Oceania"
â Mawg
12 hours ago
1
Oops! That's three ;-)
â Mawg
12 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
31
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Let's imagine that this were to actually happen. Major members of the two parties realized that what you said was true, and that if they could cooperate then they would totally and completely dominate the political system, and could do whatever they wanted, no matter what the electorate said, and no matter how bad it was for those governed.
They would soon realize that there was a problem, in that the electorate like to have a choice, and would unquestionably form some sort of opposition to any government that tried to rule without offering a choice.
The solution they would come up with, in order to make this dominance happen, would be to offer the illusion of choice. So they would agree to offer the electorate two alternatives, ensuring their continued dominance in two ways:
- Making the two 'alternatives' actually very similar. So rather than offering options that might be popular in other countries, such as increased healthcare or higher wages, offer two choices that differ only very slightly from each other.
- Keep up the appearance of strong enmity between the parties, and couple it with a very complex and oppositional legislative system, with no way of resolving disputes if two parts of the legislature disagree. This ensures that there is always a good reason not to pass laws or make changes, no matter how popular. It's always the fault of that pesky other party that nothing can be done.
So that's what would probably happen if this was tried. I leave any conclusions to the reader.
1
'higher wages' What country has higher median wages than the USA? (Answer: none.) Maybe you mean higher minimum wages, which don't necessarily mean higher wages overall?
â reirab
yesterday
3
I think that "higher wages" is clear, and the link for "household disposable income" does not tell us what the median wage is (first, it is a mean; second, it includes property income)
â adam.r
yesterday
1
@reirab Household disposable income is not the same as wages, and the data you link to only includes 35 countries out of 193. The US does not have the highest wages in the world. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_average_wage
â Mike Scott
yesterday
1
@MikeScott Yes, OECD is only 35 countries, but it includes nearly all countries with fully-developed economies. At any rate, your link shows exactly one country with a mean wage higher than the U.S., a city-state banking center. Not sure that the existence of exactly one country with a higher mean wage than the U.S. (by around 3%) is really helping DJ's point.
â reirab
22 hours ago
@reirab thatâÂÂs not the point DJ is making. TheyâÂÂre saying one party might offer free healthcare, the other night promise wages higher than they currently are. Instead, under this system, they both offer very similar choices, with little difference.
â Tim
20 hours ago
 |Â
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8
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In the US, the two parties comparative to most of Europe are not ideologically far apart. First-past-the-post elections tend to concentrate on winning the "independent" voter which has a tempering impact on ideological shift. What you are referring to has a name; it's called the uniparty that is generally benefits from Pax Americana and is globalist, free-trade, open-borders, and definitely pro-spending. Here's a snippet on the uniparty.
The Republican PartyâÂÂs leaders have functioned as junior members of AmericaâÂÂs single ruling party, the UniParty. Acting as the proverbial cockboat in the wake of the Democratsâ man-of-war, they have made Democratic priorities their own when the White House and the Congress were in the hands of Republicans as well as in those of Democrats, and when control has been mixed. The UniParty, the party of government, the party of Ins, continues to consist of the same people. The Outs are always the same people too: American conservatives. They donâÂÂt have a party.
Whatever differences exist within the Uniparty, between Republican John Boehner and Democrat Nancy Pelosi, between Republican Mitch McConnell and Democrat Harry Reid, get worked out behind closed doors. Those differences are narrow. The latest negotiations were over some $80 billion out of three trillion dollars in spending. The bipartisan negotiators did not let into the room any of the major issues that concern Americans. Not Obamacare, not racial preferences, not religious liberty, not endless no-win wars. The UniParty is unanimous: more of the same!
Here's some more from Politico
âÂÂThe Unipartyâ is the latest populist buzzword to seize the imagination of the drain-the-swamp crowd, those who see grand conspiracies in the machinations of the âÂÂdeep stateâ and globalist-corporate forces. It has a crisp clarity, instantly conveying the idea of an establishment cabal, Democrat and Republican alike, arrayed against their outsider hero, Donald Trump.
But while âÂÂthe Unipartyâ may be trendy among the Breitbart set, it wasnâÂÂt born there. In fact, if you go back to the contentious presidential race of 2000, youâÂÂll find it arose as a political barb among supporters of Ralph Nader, running as the nominee of the Green Party.
Numerous posts on the Usenet newsgroup alt.politics.green from that year railed against âÂÂthe two-headed UniParty,â âÂÂthe money-driven media/political uniparty environment,â âÂÂthe corporate Uniparty grip on the civic polity,â and so forth.
This article also is really good
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6
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I actually upvoted K Dog's answer because "uniparty" is probably the hypothesis being advanced by the question (which itself is rather vague). But it's also easy to see why doesn't really work that way: primaries. It's easy for a party to change is position over time when its candidates are elected too, and that happens in the primaries. Just look how the Republican part of the "uniparty" got turned toward a new discourse by the Trump takeover. Not long before that was the Tea Party etc.
The "uniparty" only lasts as long as there's not a strong enough grassroots base for some divergent idea to be embraced by candidates in the primaries of one of the parties (but not the other). And there can be many such issues causing a divergence. And empirical data nicely shown in another question here actually points to a divergence rather than converges of the two main parties on ideology. The graph in the question linked is only about Congress, but there's separate data that that divergence really comes from the public divergence (i.e. it's not just some fight between two small cliques of politicians):
So you can't get a "uniparty" from that trend... unless the elections get subverted somehow.
The importance of the primaries in the US for the good functioning of the democracy as really representative is emphasized by the laws that provide public funding for primaries, etc., in order to prevent them from being a closed club.
This is ranking values, not outcomes. Both parties say things to appeal to their bases, and vote differently. But the truth is there were only 3 fairly conservative GOP presidents during the whole of the 20th century, and the trend for more government no matter the need is the indisputable trend.
â K Dog
yesterday
@KDog: I see that the "uniparty" argument is (now) basically that both parties are for "big government". That's quite a bit narrower... but I suspect also false except for those who want a radically smaller government, which might be too few in numbers. Either that or what Putin said is correct :-0
â Fizz
yesterday
I think that it is the best answer. The lack of proportionality (first past the post) makes it easier to move the political discussion from the election proper to the primaries. Ideological currents that in a proportional system would be its own party have it easier chosing the closer party and winning it over. Otherwise, the spoiler effect would benefit the party that is most ideologically opposed. Examples would be the Tea Party, Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump.
â SJuan76
yesterday
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up vote
4
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let's turn the question around and assume that we already have such a situation where both parties have (at least de-facto) merged into a single Party. Then because the public opinion on many issues tends to have a 50-50 split due to social dynamics, this will cause tensions within the Party. Many issues will have a typical conservative or liberal points of view, so there will be strong correlations between Party members and their views; typically two party members will agree with each other on most issues or they will disagree with each other on most issues. This will then ultimately cause the Party to break-up into a liberal faction and a conservative faction.
This instability of a single Party state will then prevent two dominant parties from merging into a single Party.
4
The 50-50 split isn't due to social dynamics, it is due to political incentives. Parties need to be part of a majority coalition to get policy enacted, but the bigger your tent, the more diluted your ability to advocate for strong policies that favor those in the tent relative to those outside it becomes. The only difference between multi-party systems with proportional representation and a two party system in this regard, is that the former makes their coalition temporary for the election or after the election, while in the U.S. the coalitions are formed before the election begins.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago
1
You can see an example of this merge and subsequent split in the early US. The Federalists collapsed as a viable party, resulting in an effective merger with the Democratic-Republicans. Shortly thereafter, the Democratic-Republicans split into the Jacksonian and Anti-Jacksonian factions.
â Mark
2 days ago
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up vote
4
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This is so-called two steps forward, one step back approach in controlling population
You create two at first glance bitterly opposed parties that seemingly oppose each other on number of important issues. One party comes to power and impose some unpopular law or issue. Other party rides on wave of popular indignation with the measure, but when finally after elections comes to power does little or nothing to change situation. Instead, it repeats the cycle with some other unpopular act, and cycle repeats itself.
Other parties and other issues (which could be very important, but two major parties agree on them) are ignored by mass media, so voters do not know about them .
Examples from real life :
Most Americans started opposing Iraq war in 2005. War was Republican endeavor, and led to rise of Democrats and Obama who portrayed themselves as doves. But when Democrats took power, they actually increased US military involment around the world, especially in Middle East (Libya, Syria etc ...)
Most Americans opposed homosexual marriage in 2009. It was Democrats measure to push it on whole country, with lot of Republicans bitterly opposing it. But when Republicans finally took power in 2017 they declared that "homosexual marriage is law of the land" and did nothing to overturn this decision.
Large number of Americans oppose abortion, especially late-term abortion . In fact anti-abortionist are becoming majority lately. Republicans often campaign on this issue, and often enact some minor laws on state level that more usually then not get overturned by Federal judges. Yet, despite obvious problem (Roe v. Wade) , Republicans never muster an effort to define unborn children as humans (let's say from seventh week of pregnancy) , therefore giving them legal protection from killing.
As we could see from this example, both Republicans and Democrats act like different cycles of same engine that pushes US in direction not necessarily in interest of its population, and their largely ceremonial confrontation sucks the oxygen from other political movements.
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up vote
3
down vote
Walter Karp argued that US political parties form a virtual bipartisan oligarchy which colludes together for the primary purposes of mutual self-preservation and maintaining organizational power in his 1973 Indispensable Enemies: The Politics of Misrule in America.
The summary is rather weak. Have a copy, but haven't yet more than skimmed it...
â agc
yesterday
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
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They did when they had a common external enemy, and the world was better for it.
The United States fought the fascists during World War II (1941-1945), and the Soviet Union during the Cold War (1945-1991). During this period, the country faced a common external enemy, and Democrats and Republicans cooperated to unprecedented levels. Among the accomplishments:
- Willingness from both political parties to engage in foreign affairs, form alliances, and negotiate treaties and trade pacts.
- Serving as a political and economic superpower.
- Actively participate in the United Nations and NATO.
- Aiding other countries through the International Monetary Fund and World Bank, which helped the reconstruction of much of Europe and Japan after WWII.
- Development of the Interstate Highway system.
- Funding (or in some cases, directly pursuing) scientific research through the National Science Foundation, National Institutes of Health, Department of Energy, and DARPA.
- Through DARPA, funding the initial development of the Internet that you are now using.
- Providing funding for public elementary, secondary, and higher education.
- Providing stable government institutions. As much as Reagan talked about cutting government, in practice most agencies grew during his tenure.
- Enthusiastically operating a space program -- and most notably -- putting men on the moon.
After the fall of the Soviet Union, the enemy became each other. Democrats and Republicans turned on each other, in increasing rounds of tit-for-tat. Indeed, during the last 25 years we have seen the following:
- Paranoia that the United Nations is a world government which is controlling American politics.
- Using foreign countries as a scapegoat for job losses.
- Isolationism.
- Withdrawal from NATO, NAFTA, TPP, and other alliances and trade pacts.
- The loss of international respect and influence of the United States.
- Cutting foreign aid (particularly for "s---hole countries").
- Deteriorating infrastructure (e.g. collapsed roads and bridges, contaminated public water supplies). Refusing to repair or replace it because of a fear of taxes and government spending.
- Cutting scientific funding (e.g. Superconducting Supercollider).
- Mocking science as an "opinion" (e.g. evolution, climate change, endangered species).
- Refusing to regulate the monopolies that control much of the Internet.
- Cutting funding for public elementary, secondary, and higher education (mostly by state governments).
- Turning education over to for-profit corporations.
- Mocking (e.g. "Deep State"), defunding, and harassing government institutions.
- Allowing the space program to wither to the point where we use Russian rockets to send astronauts into space.
Since the question mentions "any two party system" (which I take to mean countries other than the US), you could expand your answer to include Britain during World War II as well, which saw unprecedented levels of bipartisan cooperation due to the Nazi threat.
â CJ Dennis
17 hours ago
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They kind of do, in an effort to swing the country further right and enable corruption. RomneyCare/ObamaCare was originally written by GOP thinktanks and insurance companies to appease democrats and prevent a swing towards universal healthcare. The democrats, who work for the same people, coopted and took ownership of the plan, establishing it as a progressive/left position and enabling both parties to effectively block universal healthcare in about the same way while appearing to their bases to be representing opposite sides.
You can find similar examples in union busting, banking deregulation, elimination of anti-trust enforcement, etc. They work towards the same goals while giving the appearance of fighting, a carefully choreographed dance for their mutual financial supporters.
3
Can you back up your answer? Answers without references tend to be downvoted and/or removed.
â Alexei
2 days ago
This does not provide an answer to the question. To critique or request clarification from an author, leave a comment below their post. - From Review
â nelruk
18 hours ago
Seems to me that by saying the same thing as several others, either this is an answer or most of the others aren't.
â WGroleau
3 hours ago
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9 Answers
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9 Answers
9
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oldest
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active
oldest
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active
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up vote
76
down vote
I mean, we've had exclusively Democrat or Republican governments for well over 150 years, I'm not sure how else you'd measure "total and perpetual dominance".
10
~150 out of last 242 years to be exact for the two existing parties. At a rate around 61.2% of the entire history of the US belonging to these two parties, it's hard to quantify it as anything but total dominance.
â Anoplexian
2 days ago
1
"We have always been at war with Oceania"
â Mawg
12 hours ago
1
Oops! That's three ;-)
â Mawg
12 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
76
down vote
I mean, we've had exclusively Democrat or Republican governments for well over 150 years, I'm not sure how else you'd measure "total and perpetual dominance".
10
~150 out of last 242 years to be exact for the two existing parties. At a rate around 61.2% of the entire history of the US belonging to these two parties, it's hard to quantify it as anything but total dominance.
â Anoplexian
2 days ago
1
"We have always been at war with Oceania"
â Mawg
12 hours ago
1
Oops! That's three ;-)
â Mawg
12 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
76
down vote
up vote
76
down vote
I mean, we've had exclusively Democrat or Republican governments for well over 150 years, I'm not sure how else you'd measure "total and perpetual dominance".
I mean, we've had exclusively Democrat or Republican governments for well over 150 years, I'm not sure how else you'd measure "total and perpetual dominance".
answered 2 days ago
David Rice
75916
75916
10
~150 out of last 242 years to be exact for the two existing parties. At a rate around 61.2% of the entire history of the US belonging to these two parties, it's hard to quantify it as anything but total dominance.
â Anoplexian
2 days ago
1
"We have always been at war with Oceania"
â Mawg
12 hours ago
1
Oops! That's three ;-)
â Mawg
12 hours ago
add a comment |Â
10
~150 out of last 242 years to be exact for the two existing parties. At a rate around 61.2% of the entire history of the US belonging to these two parties, it's hard to quantify it as anything but total dominance.
â Anoplexian
2 days ago
1
"We have always been at war with Oceania"
â Mawg
12 hours ago
1
Oops! That's three ;-)
â Mawg
12 hours ago
10
10
~150 out of last 242 years to be exact for the two existing parties. At a rate around 61.2% of the entire history of the US belonging to these two parties, it's hard to quantify it as anything but total dominance.
â Anoplexian
2 days ago
~150 out of last 242 years to be exact for the two existing parties. At a rate around 61.2% of the entire history of the US belonging to these two parties, it's hard to quantify it as anything but total dominance.
â Anoplexian
2 days ago
1
1
"We have always been at war with Oceania"
â Mawg
12 hours ago
"We have always been at war with Oceania"
â Mawg
12 hours ago
1
1
Oops! That's three ;-)
â Mawg
12 hours ago
Oops! That's three ;-)
â Mawg
12 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
31
down vote
Let's imagine that this were to actually happen. Major members of the two parties realized that what you said was true, and that if they could cooperate then they would totally and completely dominate the political system, and could do whatever they wanted, no matter what the electorate said, and no matter how bad it was for those governed.
They would soon realize that there was a problem, in that the electorate like to have a choice, and would unquestionably form some sort of opposition to any government that tried to rule without offering a choice.
The solution they would come up with, in order to make this dominance happen, would be to offer the illusion of choice. So they would agree to offer the electorate two alternatives, ensuring their continued dominance in two ways:
- Making the two 'alternatives' actually very similar. So rather than offering options that might be popular in other countries, such as increased healthcare or higher wages, offer two choices that differ only very slightly from each other.
- Keep up the appearance of strong enmity between the parties, and couple it with a very complex and oppositional legislative system, with no way of resolving disputes if two parts of the legislature disagree. This ensures that there is always a good reason not to pass laws or make changes, no matter how popular. It's always the fault of that pesky other party that nothing can be done.
So that's what would probably happen if this was tried. I leave any conclusions to the reader.
1
'higher wages' What country has higher median wages than the USA? (Answer: none.) Maybe you mean higher minimum wages, which don't necessarily mean higher wages overall?
â reirab
yesterday
3
I think that "higher wages" is clear, and the link for "household disposable income" does not tell us what the median wage is (first, it is a mean; second, it includes property income)
â adam.r
yesterday
1
@reirab Household disposable income is not the same as wages, and the data you link to only includes 35 countries out of 193. The US does not have the highest wages in the world. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_average_wage
â Mike Scott
yesterday
1
@MikeScott Yes, OECD is only 35 countries, but it includes nearly all countries with fully-developed economies. At any rate, your link shows exactly one country with a mean wage higher than the U.S., a city-state banking center. Not sure that the existence of exactly one country with a higher mean wage than the U.S. (by around 3%) is really helping DJ's point.
â reirab
22 hours ago
@reirab thatâÂÂs not the point DJ is making. TheyâÂÂre saying one party might offer free healthcare, the other night promise wages higher than they currently are. Instead, under this system, they both offer very similar choices, with little difference.
â Tim
20 hours ago
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
31
down vote
Let's imagine that this were to actually happen. Major members of the two parties realized that what you said was true, and that if they could cooperate then they would totally and completely dominate the political system, and could do whatever they wanted, no matter what the electorate said, and no matter how bad it was for those governed.
They would soon realize that there was a problem, in that the electorate like to have a choice, and would unquestionably form some sort of opposition to any government that tried to rule without offering a choice.
The solution they would come up with, in order to make this dominance happen, would be to offer the illusion of choice. So they would agree to offer the electorate two alternatives, ensuring their continued dominance in two ways:
- Making the two 'alternatives' actually very similar. So rather than offering options that might be popular in other countries, such as increased healthcare or higher wages, offer two choices that differ only very slightly from each other.
- Keep up the appearance of strong enmity between the parties, and couple it with a very complex and oppositional legislative system, with no way of resolving disputes if two parts of the legislature disagree. This ensures that there is always a good reason not to pass laws or make changes, no matter how popular. It's always the fault of that pesky other party that nothing can be done.
So that's what would probably happen if this was tried. I leave any conclusions to the reader.
1
'higher wages' What country has higher median wages than the USA? (Answer: none.) Maybe you mean higher minimum wages, which don't necessarily mean higher wages overall?
â reirab
yesterday
3
I think that "higher wages" is clear, and the link for "household disposable income" does not tell us what the median wage is (first, it is a mean; second, it includes property income)
â adam.r
yesterday
1
@reirab Household disposable income is not the same as wages, and the data you link to only includes 35 countries out of 193. The US does not have the highest wages in the world. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_average_wage
â Mike Scott
yesterday
1
@MikeScott Yes, OECD is only 35 countries, but it includes nearly all countries with fully-developed economies. At any rate, your link shows exactly one country with a mean wage higher than the U.S., a city-state banking center. Not sure that the existence of exactly one country with a higher mean wage than the U.S. (by around 3%) is really helping DJ's point.
â reirab
22 hours ago
@reirab thatâÂÂs not the point DJ is making. TheyâÂÂre saying one party might offer free healthcare, the other night promise wages higher than they currently are. Instead, under this system, they both offer very similar choices, with little difference.
â Tim
20 hours ago
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
31
down vote
up vote
31
down vote
Let's imagine that this were to actually happen. Major members of the two parties realized that what you said was true, and that if they could cooperate then they would totally and completely dominate the political system, and could do whatever they wanted, no matter what the electorate said, and no matter how bad it was for those governed.
They would soon realize that there was a problem, in that the electorate like to have a choice, and would unquestionably form some sort of opposition to any government that tried to rule without offering a choice.
The solution they would come up with, in order to make this dominance happen, would be to offer the illusion of choice. So they would agree to offer the electorate two alternatives, ensuring their continued dominance in two ways:
- Making the two 'alternatives' actually very similar. So rather than offering options that might be popular in other countries, such as increased healthcare or higher wages, offer two choices that differ only very slightly from each other.
- Keep up the appearance of strong enmity between the parties, and couple it with a very complex and oppositional legislative system, with no way of resolving disputes if two parts of the legislature disagree. This ensures that there is always a good reason not to pass laws or make changes, no matter how popular. It's always the fault of that pesky other party that nothing can be done.
So that's what would probably happen if this was tried. I leave any conclusions to the reader.
Let's imagine that this were to actually happen. Major members of the two parties realized that what you said was true, and that if they could cooperate then they would totally and completely dominate the political system, and could do whatever they wanted, no matter what the electorate said, and no matter how bad it was for those governed.
They would soon realize that there was a problem, in that the electorate like to have a choice, and would unquestionably form some sort of opposition to any government that tried to rule without offering a choice.
The solution they would come up with, in order to make this dominance happen, would be to offer the illusion of choice. So they would agree to offer the electorate two alternatives, ensuring their continued dominance in two ways:
- Making the two 'alternatives' actually very similar. So rather than offering options that might be popular in other countries, such as increased healthcare or higher wages, offer two choices that differ only very slightly from each other.
- Keep up the appearance of strong enmity between the parties, and couple it with a very complex and oppositional legislative system, with no way of resolving disputes if two parts of the legislature disagree. This ensures that there is always a good reason not to pass laws or make changes, no matter how popular. It's always the fault of that pesky other party that nothing can be done.
So that's what would probably happen if this was tried. I leave any conclusions to the reader.
edited 2 days ago
answered 2 days ago
![](https://i.stack.imgur.com/Sqgx6.jpg?s=32&g=1)
![](https://i.stack.imgur.com/Sqgx6.jpg?s=32&g=1)
DJClayworth
4,0331631
4,0331631
1
'higher wages' What country has higher median wages than the USA? (Answer: none.) Maybe you mean higher minimum wages, which don't necessarily mean higher wages overall?
â reirab
yesterday
3
I think that "higher wages" is clear, and the link for "household disposable income" does not tell us what the median wage is (first, it is a mean; second, it includes property income)
â adam.r
yesterday
1
@reirab Household disposable income is not the same as wages, and the data you link to only includes 35 countries out of 193. The US does not have the highest wages in the world. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_average_wage
â Mike Scott
yesterday
1
@MikeScott Yes, OECD is only 35 countries, but it includes nearly all countries with fully-developed economies. At any rate, your link shows exactly one country with a mean wage higher than the U.S., a city-state banking center. Not sure that the existence of exactly one country with a higher mean wage than the U.S. (by around 3%) is really helping DJ's point.
â reirab
22 hours ago
@reirab thatâÂÂs not the point DJ is making. TheyâÂÂre saying one party might offer free healthcare, the other night promise wages higher than they currently are. Instead, under this system, they both offer very similar choices, with little difference.
â Tim
20 hours ago
 |Â
show 1 more comment
1
'higher wages' What country has higher median wages than the USA? (Answer: none.) Maybe you mean higher minimum wages, which don't necessarily mean higher wages overall?
â reirab
yesterday
3
I think that "higher wages" is clear, and the link for "household disposable income" does not tell us what the median wage is (first, it is a mean; second, it includes property income)
â adam.r
yesterday
1
@reirab Household disposable income is not the same as wages, and the data you link to only includes 35 countries out of 193. The US does not have the highest wages in the world. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_average_wage
â Mike Scott
yesterday
1
@MikeScott Yes, OECD is only 35 countries, but it includes nearly all countries with fully-developed economies. At any rate, your link shows exactly one country with a mean wage higher than the U.S., a city-state banking center. Not sure that the existence of exactly one country with a higher mean wage than the U.S. (by around 3%) is really helping DJ's point.
â reirab
22 hours ago
@reirab thatâÂÂs not the point DJ is making. TheyâÂÂre saying one party might offer free healthcare, the other night promise wages higher than they currently are. Instead, under this system, they both offer very similar choices, with little difference.
â Tim
20 hours ago
1
1
'higher wages' What country has higher median wages than the USA? (Answer: none.) Maybe you mean higher minimum wages, which don't necessarily mean higher wages overall?
â reirab
yesterday
'higher wages' What country has higher median wages than the USA? (Answer: none.) Maybe you mean higher minimum wages, which don't necessarily mean higher wages overall?
â reirab
yesterday
3
3
I think that "higher wages" is clear, and the link for "household disposable income" does not tell us what the median wage is (first, it is a mean; second, it includes property income)
â adam.r
yesterday
I think that "higher wages" is clear, and the link for "household disposable income" does not tell us what the median wage is (first, it is a mean; second, it includes property income)
â adam.r
yesterday
1
1
@reirab Household disposable income is not the same as wages, and the data you link to only includes 35 countries out of 193. The US does not have the highest wages in the world. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_average_wage
â Mike Scott
yesterday
@reirab Household disposable income is not the same as wages, and the data you link to only includes 35 countries out of 193. The US does not have the highest wages in the world. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_average_wage
â Mike Scott
yesterday
1
1
@MikeScott Yes, OECD is only 35 countries, but it includes nearly all countries with fully-developed economies. At any rate, your link shows exactly one country with a mean wage higher than the U.S., a city-state banking center. Not sure that the existence of exactly one country with a higher mean wage than the U.S. (by around 3%) is really helping DJ's point.
â reirab
22 hours ago
@MikeScott Yes, OECD is only 35 countries, but it includes nearly all countries with fully-developed economies. At any rate, your link shows exactly one country with a mean wage higher than the U.S., a city-state banking center. Not sure that the existence of exactly one country with a higher mean wage than the U.S. (by around 3%) is really helping DJ's point.
â reirab
22 hours ago
@reirab thatâÂÂs not the point DJ is making. TheyâÂÂre saying one party might offer free healthcare, the other night promise wages higher than they currently are. Instead, under this system, they both offer very similar choices, with little difference.
â Tim
20 hours ago
@reirab thatâÂÂs not the point DJ is making. TheyâÂÂre saying one party might offer free healthcare, the other night promise wages higher than they currently are. Instead, under this system, they both offer very similar choices, with little difference.
â Tim
20 hours ago
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
8
down vote
In the US, the two parties comparative to most of Europe are not ideologically far apart. First-past-the-post elections tend to concentrate on winning the "independent" voter which has a tempering impact on ideological shift. What you are referring to has a name; it's called the uniparty that is generally benefits from Pax Americana and is globalist, free-trade, open-borders, and definitely pro-spending. Here's a snippet on the uniparty.
The Republican PartyâÂÂs leaders have functioned as junior members of AmericaâÂÂs single ruling party, the UniParty. Acting as the proverbial cockboat in the wake of the Democratsâ man-of-war, they have made Democratic priorities their own when the White House and the Congress were in the hands of Republicans as well as in those of Democrats, and when control has been mixed. The UniParty, the party of government, the party of Ins, continues to consist of the same people. The Outs are always the same people too: American conservatives. They donâÂÂt have a party.
Whatever differences exist within the Uniparty, between Republican John Boehner and Democrat Nancy Pelosi, between Republican Mitch McConnell and Democrat Harry Reid, get worked out behind closed doors. Those differences are narrow. The latest negotiations were over some $80 billion out of three trillion dollars in spending. The bipartisan negotiators did not let into the room any of the major issues that concern Americans. Not Obamacare, not racial preferences, not religious liberty, not endless no-win wars. The UniParty is unanimous: more of the same!
Here's some more from Politico
âÂÂThe Unipartyâ is the latest populist buzzword to seize the imagination of the drain-the-swamp crowd, those who see grand conspiracies in the machinations of the âÂÂdeep stateâ and globalist-corporate forces. It has a crisp clarity, instantly conveying the idea of an establishment cabal, Democrat and Republican alike, arrayed against their outsider hero, Donald Trump.
But while âÂÂthe Unipartyâ may be trendy among the Breitbart set, it wasnâÂÂt born there. In fact, if you go back to the contentious presidential race of 2000, youâÂÂll find it arose as a political barb among supporters of Ralph Nader, running as the nominee of the Green Party.
Numerous posts on the Usenet newsgroup alt.politics.green from that year railed against âÂÂthe two-headed UniParty,â âÂÂthe money-driven media/political uniparty environment,â âÂÂthe corporate Uniparty grip on the civic polity,â and so forth.
This article also is really good
add a comment |Â
up vote
8
down vote
In the US, the two parties comparative to most of Europe are not ideologically far apart. First-past-the-post elections tend to concentrate on winning the "independent" voter which has a tempering impact on ideological shift. What you are referring to has a name; it's called the uniparty that is generally benefits from Pax Americana and is globalist, free-trade, open-borders, and definitely pro-spending. Here's a snippet on the uniparty.
The Republican PartyâÂÂs leaders have functioned as junior members of AmericaâÂÂs single ruling party, the UniParty. Acting as the proverbial cockboat in the wake of the Democratsâ man-of-war, they have made Democratic priorities their own when the White House and the Congress were in the hands of Republicans as well as in those of Democrats, and when control has been mixed. The UniParty, the party of government, the party of Ins, continues to consist of the same people. The Outs are always the same people too: American conservatives. They donâÂÂt have a party.
Whatever differences exist within the Uniparty, between Republican John Boehner and Democrat Nancy Pelosi, between Republican Mitch McConnell and Democrat Harry Reid, get worked out behind closed doors. Those differences are narrow. The latest negotiations were over some $80 billion out of three trillion dollars in spending. The bipartisan negotiators did not let into the room any of the major issues that concern Americans. Not Obamacare, not racial preferences, not religious liberty, not endless no-win wars. The UniParty is unanimous: more of the same!
Here's some more from Politico
âÂÂThe Unipartyâ is the latest populist buzzword to seize the imagination of the drain-the-swamp crowd, those who see grand conspiracies in the machinations of the âÂÂdeep stateâ and globalist-corporate forces. It has a crisp clarity, instantly conveying the idea of an establishment cabal, Democrat and Republican alike, arrayed against their outsider hero, Donald Trump.
But while âÂÂthe Unipartyâ may be trendy among the Breitbart set, it wasnâÂÂt born there. In fact, if you go back to the contentious presidential race of 2000, youâÂÂll find it arose as a political barb among supporters of Ralph Nader, running as the nominee of the Green Party.
Numerous posts on the Usenet newsgroup alt.politics.green from that year railed against âÂÂthe two-headed UniParty,â âÂÂthe money-driven media/political uniparty environment,â âÂÂthe corporate Uniparty grip on the civic polity,â and so forth.
This article also is really good
add a comment |Â
up vote
8
down vote
up vote
8
down vote
In the US, the two parties comparative to most of Europe are not ideologically far apart. First-past-the-post elections tend to concentrate on winning the "independent" voter which has a tempering impact on ideological shift. What you are referring to has a name; it's called the uniparty that is generally benefits from Pax Americana and is globalist, free-trade, open-borders, and definitely pro-spending. Here's a snippet on the uniparty.
The Republican PartyâÂÂs leaders have functioned as junior members of AmericaâÂÂs single ruling party, the UniParty. Acting as the proverbial cockboat in the wake of the Democratsâ man-of-war, they have made Democratic priorities their own when the White House and the Congress were in the hands of Republicans as well as in those of Democrats, and when control has been mixed. The UniParty, the party of government, the party of Ins, continues to consist of the same people. The Outs are always the same people too: American conservatives. They donâÂÂt have a party.
Whatever differences exist within the Uniparty, between Republican John Boehner and Democrat Nancy Pelosi, between Republican Mitch McConnell and Democrat Harry Reid, get worked out behind closed doors. Those differences are narrow. The latest negotiations were over some $80 billion out of three trillion dollars in spending. The bipartisan negotiators did not let into the room any of the major issues that concern Americans. Not Obamacare, not racial preferences, not religious liberty, not endless no-win wars. The UniParty is unanimous: more of the same!
Here's some more from Politico
âÂÂThe Unipartyâ is the latest populist buzzword to seize the imagination of the drain-the-swamp crowd, those who see grand conspiracies in the machinations of the âÂÂdeep stateâ and globalist-corporate forces. It has a crisp clarity, instantly conveying the idea of an establishment cabal, Democrat and Republican alike, arrayed against their outsider hero, Donald Trump.
But while âÂÂthe Unipartyâ may be trendy among the Breitbart set, it wasnâÂÂt born there. In fact, if you go back to the contentious presidential race of 2000, youâÂÂll find it arose as a political barb among supporters of Ralph Nader, running as the nominee of the Green Party.
Numerous posts on the Usenet newsgroup alt.politics.green from that year railed against âÂÂthe two-headed UniParty,â âÂÂthe money-driven media/political uniparty environment,â âÂÂthe corporate Uniparty grip on the civic polity,â and so forth.
This article also is really good
In the US, the two parties comparative to most of Europe are not ideologically far apart. First-past-the-post elections tend to concentrate on winning the "independent" voter which has a tempering impact on ideological shift. What you are referring to has a name; it's called the uniparty that is generally benefits from Pax Americana and is globalist, free-trade, open-borders, and definitely pro-spending. Here's a snippet on the uniparty.
The Republican PartyâÂÂs leaders have functioned as junior members of AmericaâÂÂs single ruling party, the UniParty. Acting as the proverbial cockboat in the wake of the Democratsâ man-of-war, they have made Democratic priorities their own when the White House and the Congress were in the hands of Republicans as well as in those of Democrats, and when control has been mixed. The UniParty, the party of government, the party of Ins, continues to consist of the same people. The Outs are always the same people too: American conservatives. They donâÂÂt have a party.
Whatever differences exist within the Uniparty, between Republican John Boehner and Democrat Nancy Pelosi, between Republican Mitch McConnell and Democrat Harry Reid, get worked out behind closed doors. Those differences are narrow. The latest negotiations were over some $80 billion out of three trillion dollars in spending. The bipartisan negotiators did not let into the room any of the major issues that concern Americans. Not Obamacare, not racial preferences, not religious liberty, not endless no-win wars. The UniParty is unanimous: more of the same!
Here's some more from Politico
âÂÂThe Unipartyâ is the latest populist buzzword to seize the imagination of the drain-the-swamp crowd, those who see grand conspiracies in the machinations of the âÂÂdeep stateâ and globalist-corporate forces. It has a crisp clarity, instantly conveying the idea of an establishment cabal, Democrat and Republican alike, arrayed against their outsider hero, Donald Trump.
But while âÂÂthe Unipartyâ may be trendy among the Breitbart set, it wasnâÂÂt born there. In fact, if you go back to the contentious presidential race of 2000, youâÂÂll find it arose as a political barb among supporters of Ralph Nader, running as the nominee of the Green Party.
Numerous posts on the Usenet newsgroup alt.politics.green from that year railed against âÂÂthe two-headed UniParty,â âÂÂthe money-driven media/political uniparty environment,â âÂÂthe corporate Uniparty grip on the civic polity,â and so forth.
This article also is really good
edited yesterday
answered 2 days ago
![](https://i.stack.imgur.com/llI5E.jpg?s=32&g=1)
![](https://i.stack.imgur.com/llI5E.jpg?s=32&g=1)
K Dog
8,45612356
8,45612356
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
up vote
6
down vote
I actually upvoted K Dog's answer because "uniparty" is probably the hypothesis being advanced by the question (which itself is rather vague). But it's also easy to see why doesn't really work that way: primaries. It's easy for a party to change is position over time when its candidates are elected too, and that happens in the primaries. Just look how the Republican part of the "uniparty" got turned toward a new discourse by the Trump takeover. Not long before that was the Tea Party etc.
The "uniparty" only lasts as long as there's not a strong enough grassroots base for some divergent idea to be embraced by candidates in the primaries of one of the parties (but not the other). And there can be many such issues causing a divergence. And empirical data nicely shown in another question here actually points to a divergence rather than converges of the two main parties on ideology. The graph in the question linked is only about Congress, but there's separate data that that divergence really comes from the public divergence (i.e. it's not just some fight between two small cliques of politicians):
So you can't get a "uniparty" from that trend... unless the elections get subverted somehow.
The importance of the primaries in the US for the good functioning of the democracy as really representative is emphasized by the laws that provide public funding for primaries, etc., in order to prevent them from being a closed club.
This is ranking values, not outcomes. Both parties say things to appeal to their bases, and vote differently. But the truth is there were only 3 fairly conservative GOP presidents during the whole of the 20th century, and the trend for more government no matter the need is the indisputable trend.
â K Dog
yesterday
@KDog: I see that the "uniparty" argument is (now) basically that both parties are for "big government". That's quite a bit narrower... but I suspect also false except for those who want a radically smaller government, which might be too few in numbers. Either that or what Putin said is correct :-0
â Fizz
yesterday
I think that it is the best answer. The lack of proportionality (first past the post) makes it easier to move the political discussion from the election proper to the primaries. Ideological currents that in a proportional system would be its own party have it easier chosing the closer party and winning it over. Otherwise, the spoiler effect would benefit the party that is most ideologically opposed. Examples would be the Tea Party, Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump.
â SJuan76
yesterday
add a comment |Â
up vote
6
down vote
I actually upvoted K Dog's answer because "uniparty" is probably the hypothesis being advanced by the question (which itself is rather vague). But it's also easy to see why doesn't really work that way: primaries. It's easy for a party to change is position over time when its candidates are elected too, and that happens in the primaries. Just look how the Republican part of the "uniparty" got turned toward a new discourse by the Trump takeover. Not long before that was the Tea Party etc.
The "uniparty" only lasts as long as there's not a strong enough grassroots base for some divergent idea to be embraced by candidates in the primaries of one of the parties (but not the other). And there can be many such issues causing a divergence. And empirical data nicely shown in another question here actually points to a divergence rather than converges of the two main parties on ideology. The graph in the question linked is only about Congress, but there's separate data that that divergence really comes from the public divergence (i.e. it's not just some fight between two small cliques of politicians):
So you can't get a "uniparty" from that trend... unless the elections get subverted somehow.
The importance of the primaries in the US for the good functioning of the democracy as really representative is emphasized by the laws that provide public funding for primaries, etc., in order to prevent them from being a closed club.
This is ranking values, not outcomes. Both parties say things to appeal to their bases, and vote differently. But the truth is there were only 3 fairly conservative GOP presidents during the whole of the 20th century, and the trend for more government no matter the need is the indisputable trend.
â K Dog
yesterday
@KDog: I see that the "uniparty" argument is (now) basically that both parties are for "big government". That's quite a bit narrower... but I suspect also false except for those who want a radically smaller government, which might be too few in numbers. Either that or what Putin said is correct :-0
â Fizz
yesterday
I think that it is the best answer. The lack of proportionality (first past the post) makes it easier to move the political discussion from the election proper to the primaries. Ideological currents that in a proportional system would be its own party have it easier chosing the closer party and winning it over. Otherwise, the spoiler effect would benefit the party that is most ideologically opposed. Examples would be the Tea Party, Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump.
â SJuan76
yesterday
add a comment |Â
up vote
6
down vote
up vote
6
down vote
I actually upvoted K Dog's answer because "uniparty" is probably the hypothesis being advanced by the question (which itself is rather vague). But it's also easy to see why doesn't really work that way: primaries. It's easy for a party to change is position over time when its candidates are elected too, and that happens in the primaries. Just look how the Republican part of the "uniparty" got turned toward a new discourse by the Trump takeover. Not long before that was the Tea Party etc.
The "uniparty" only lasts as long as there's not a strong enough grassroots base for some divergent idea to be embraced by candidates in the primaries of one of the parties (but not the other). And there can be many such issues causing a divergence. And empirical data nicely shown in another question here actually points to a divergence rather than converges of the two main parties on ideology. The graph in the question linked is only about Congress, but there's separate data that that divergence really comes from the public divergence (i.e. it's not just some fight between two small cliques of politicians):
So you can't get a "uniparty" from that trend... unless the elections get subverted somehow.
The importance of the primaries in the US for the good functioning of the democracy as really representative is emphasized by the laws that provide public funding for primaries, etc., in order to prevent them from being a closed club.
I actually upvoted K Dog's answer because "uniparty" is probably the hypothesis being advanced by the question (which itself is rather vague). But it's also easy to see why doesn't really work that way: primaries. It's easy for a party to change is position over time when its candidates are elected too, and that happens in the primaries. Just look how the Republican part of the "uniparty" got turned toward a new discourse by the Trump takeover. Not long before that was the Tea Party etc.
The "uniparty" only lasts as long as there's not a strong enough grassroots base for some divergent idea to be embraced by candidates in the primaries of one of the parties (but not the other). And there can be many such issues causing a divergence. And empirical data nicely shown in another question here actually points to a divergence rather than converges of the two main parties on ideology. The graph in the question linked is only about Congress, but there's separate data that that divergence really comes from the public divergence (i.e. it's not just some fight between two small cliques of politicians):
So you can't get a "uniparty" from that trend... unless the elections get subverted somehow.
The importance of the primaries in the US for the good functioning of the democracy as really representative is emphasized by the laws that provide public funding for primaries, etc., in order to prevent them from being a closed club.
edited yesterday
answered yesterday
![](https://i.stack.imgur.com/xRo7q.jpg?s=32&g=1)
![](https://i.stack.imgur.com/xRo7q.jpg?s=32&g=1)
Fizz
3,5091942
3,5091942
This is ranking values, not outcomes. Both parties say things to appeal to their bases, and vote differently. But the truth is there were only 3 fairly conservative GOP presidents during the whole of the 20th century, and the trend for more government no matter the need is the indisputable trend.
â K Dog
yesterday
@KDog: I see that the "uniparty" argument is (now) basically that both parties are for "big government". That's quite a bit narrower... but I suspect also false except for those who want a radically smaller government, which might be too few in numbers. Either that or what Putin said is correct :-0
â Fizz
yesterday
I think that it is the best answer. The lack of proportionality (first past the post) makes it easier to move the political discussion from the election proper to the primaries. Ideological currents that in a proportional system would be its own party have it easier chosing the closer party and winning it over. Otherwise, the spoiler effect would benefit the party that is most ideologically opposed. Examples would be the Tea Party, Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump.
â SJuan76
yesterday
add a comment |Â
This is ranking values, not outcomes. Both parties say things to appeal to their bases, and vote differently. But the truth is there were only 3 fairly conservative GOP presidents during the whole of the 20th century, and the trend for more government no matter the need is the indisputable trend.
â K Dog
yesterday
@KDog: I see that the "uniparty" argument is (now) basically that both parties are for "big government". That's quite a bit narrower... but I suspect also false except for those who want a radically smaller government, which might be too few in numbers. Either that or what Putin said is correct :-0
â Fizz
yesterday
I think that it is the best answer. The lack of proportionality (first past the post) makes it easier to move the political discussion from the election proper to the primaries. Ideological currents that in a proportional system would be its own party have it easier chosing the closer party and winning it over. Otherwise, the spoiler effect would benefit the party that is most ideologically opposed. Examples would be the Tea Party, Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump.
â SJuan76
yesterday
This is ranking values, not outcomes. Both parties say things to appeal to their bases, and vote differently. But the truth is there were only 3 fairly conservative GOP presidents during the whole of the 20th century, and the trend for more government no matter the need is the indisputable trend.
â K Dog
yesterday
This is ranking values, not outcomes. Both parties say things to appeal to their bases, and vote differently. But the truth is there were only 3 fairly conservative GOP presidents during the whole of the 20th century, and the trend for more government no matter the need is the indisputable trend.
â K Dog
yesterday
@KDog: I see that the "uniparty" argument is (now) basically that both parties are for "big government". That's quite a bit narrower... but I suspect also false except for those who want a radically smaller government, which might be too few in numbers. Either that or what Putin said is correct :-0
â Fizz
yesterday
@KDog: I see that the "uniparty" argument is (now) basically that both parties are for "big government". That's quite a bit narrower... but I suspect also false except for those who want a radically smaller government, which might be too few in numbers. Either that or what Putin said is correct :-0
â Fizz
yesterday
I think that it is the best answer. The lack of proportionality (first past the post) makes it easier to move the political discussion from the election proper to the primaries. Ideological currents that in a proportional system would be its own party have it easier chosing the closer party and winning it over. Otherwise, the spoiler effect would benefit the party that is most ideologically opposed. Examples would be the Tea Party, Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump.
â SJuan76
yesterday
I think that it is the best answer. The lack of proportionality (first past the post) makes it easier to move the political discussion from the election proper to the primaries. Ideological currents that in a proportional system would be its own party have it easier chosing the closer party and winning it over. Otherwise, the spoiler effect would benefit the party that is most ideologically opposed. Examples would be the Tea Party, Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump.
â SJuan76
yesterday
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
let's turn the question around and assume that we already have such a situation where both parties have (at least de-facto) merged into a single Party. Then because the public opinion on many issues tends to have a 50-50 split due to social dynamics, this will cause tensions within the Party. Many issues will have a typical conservative or liberal points of view, so there will be strong correlations between Party members and their views; typically two party members will agree with each other on most issues or they will disagree with each other on most issues. This will then ultimately cause the Party to break-up into a liberal faction and a conservative faction.
This instability of a single Party state will then prevent two dominant parties from merging into a single Party.
4
The 50-50 split isn't due to social dynamics, it is due to political incentives. Parties need to be part of a majority coalition to get policy enacted, but the bigger your tent, the more diluted your ability to advocate for strong policies that favor those in the tent relative to those outside it becomes. The only difference between multi-party systems with proportional representation and a two party system in this regard, is that the former makes their coalition temporary for the election or after the election, while in the U.S. the coalitions are formed before the election begins.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago
1
You can see an example of this merge and subsequent split in the early US. The Federalists collapsed as a viable party, resulting in an effective merger with the Democratic-Republicans. Shortly thereafter, the Democratic-Republicans split into the Jacksonian and Anti-Jacksonian factions.
â Mark
2 days ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
let's turn the question around and assume that we already have such a situation where both parties have (at least de-facto) merged into a single Party. Then because the public opinion on many issues tends to have a 50-50 split due to social dynamics, this will cause tensions within the Party. Many issues will have a typical conservative or liberal points of view, so there will be strong correlations between Party members and their views; typically two party members will agree with each other on most issues or they will disagree with each other on most issues. This will then ultimately cause the Party to break-up into a liberal faction and a conservative faction.
This instability of a single Party state will then prevent two dominant parties from merging into a single Party.
4
The 50-50 split isn't due to social dynamics, it is due to political incentives. Parties need to be part of a majority coalition to get policy enacted, but the bigger your tent, the more diluted your ability to advocate for strong policies that favor those in the tent relative to those outside it becomes. The only difference between multi-party systems with proportional representation and a two party system in this regard, is that the former makes their coalition temporary for the election or after the election, while in the U.S. the coalitions are formed before the election begins.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago
1
You can see an example of this merge and subsequent split in the early US. The Federalists collapsed as a viable party, resulting in an effective merger with the Democratic-Republicans. Shortly thereafter, the Democratic-Republicans split into the Jacksonian and Anti-Jacksonian factions.
â Mark
2 days ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
up vote
4
down vote
let's turn the question around and assume that we already have such a situation where both parties have (at least de-facto) merged into a single Party. Then because the public opinion on many issues tends to have a 50-50 split due to social dynamics, this will cause tensions within the Party. Many issues will have a typical conservative or liberal points of view, so there will be strong correlations between Party members and their views; typically two party members will agree with each other on most issues or they will disagree with each other on most issues. This will then ultimately cause the Party to break-up into a liberal faction and a conservative faction.
This instability of a single Party state will then prevent two dominant parties from merging into a single Party.
let's turn the question around and assume that we already have such a situation where both parties have (at least de-facto) merged into a single Party. Then because the public opinion on many issues tends to have a 50-50 split due to social dynamics, this will cause tensions within the Party. Many issues will have a typical conservative or liberal points of view, so there will be strong correlations between Party members and their views; typically two party members will agree with each other on most issues or they will disagree with each other on most issues. This will then ultimately cause the Party to break-up into a liberal faction and a conservative faction.
This instability of a single Party state will then prevent two dominant parties from merging into a single Party.
answered 2 days ago
Count Iblis
2,730619
2,730619
4
The 50-50 split isn't due to social dynamics, it is due to political incentives. Parties need to be part of a majority coalition to get policy enacted, but the bigger your tent, the more diluted your ability to advocate for strong policies that favor those in the tent relative to those outside it becomes. The only difference between multi-party systems with proportional representation and a two party system in this regard, is that the former makes their coalition temporary for the election or after the election, while in the U.S. the coalitions are formed before the election begins.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago
1
You can see an example of this merge and subsequent split in the early US. The Federalists collapsed as a viable party, resulting in an effective merger with the Democratic-Republicans. Shortly thereafter, the Democratic-Republicans split into the Jacksonian and Anti-Jacksonian factions.
â Mark
2 days ago
add a comment |Â
4
The 50-50 split isn't due to social dynamics, it is due to political incentives. Parties need to be part of a majority coalition to get policy enacted, but the bigger your tent, the more diluted your ability to advocate for strong policies that favor those in the tent relative to those outside it becomes. The only difference between multi-party systems with proportional representation and a two party system in this regard, is that the former makes their coalition temporary for the election or after the election, while in the U.S. the coalitions are formed before the election begins.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago
1
You can see an example of this merge and subsequent split in the early US. The Federalists collapsed as a viable party, resulting in an effective merger with the Democratic-Republicans. Shortly thereafter, the Democratic-Republicans split into the Jacksonian and Anti-Jacksonian factions.
â Mark
2 days ago
4
4
The 50-50 split isn't due to social dynamics, it is due to political incentives. Parties need to be part of a majority coalition to get policy enacted, but the bigger your tent, the more diluted your ability to advocate for strong policies that favor those in the tent relative to those outside it becomes. The only difference between multi-party systems with proportional representation and a two party system in this regard, is that the former makes their coalition temporary for the election or after the election, while in the U.S. the coalitions are formed before the election begins.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago
The 50-50 split isn't due to social dynamics, it is due to political incentives. Parties need to be part of a majority coalition to get policy enacted, but the bigger your tent, the more diluted your ability to advocate for strong policies that favor those in the tent relative to those outside it becomes. The only difference between multi-party systems with proportional representation and a two party system in this regard, is that the former makes their coalition temporary for the election or after the election, while in the U.S. the coalitions are formed before the election begins.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago
1
1
You can see an example of this merge and subsequent split in the early US. The Federalists collapsed as a viable party, resulting in an effective merger with the Democratic-Republicans. Shortly thereafter, the Democratic-Republicans split into the Jacksonian and Anti-Jacksonian factions.
â Mark
2 days ago
You can see an example of this merge and subsequent split in the early US. The Federalists collapsed as a viable party, resulting in an effective merger with the Democratic-Republicans. Shortly thereafter, the Democratic-Republicans split into the Jacksonian and Anti-Jacksonian factions.
â Mark
2 days ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
This is so-called two steps forward, one step back approach in controlling population
You create two at first glance bitterly opposed parties that seemingly oppose each other on number of important issues. One party comes to power and impose some unpopular law or issue. Other party rides on wave of popular indignation with the measure, but when finally after elections comes to power does little or nothing to change situation. Instead, it repeats the cycle with some other unpopular act, and cycle repeats itself.
Other parties and other issues (which could be very important, but two major parties agree on them) are ignored by mass media, so voters do not know about them .
Examples from real life :
Most Americans started opposing Iraq war in 2005. War was Republican endeavor, and led to rise of Democrats and Obama who portrayed themselves as doves. But when Democrats took power, they actually increased US military involment around the world, especially in Middle East (Libya, Syria etc ...)
Most Americans opposed homosexual marriage in 2009. It was Democrats measure to push it on whole country, with lot of Republicans bitterly opposing it. But when Republicans finally took power in 2017 they declared that "homosexual marriage is law of the land" and did nothing to overturn this decision.
Large number of Americans oppose abortion, especially late-term abortion . In fact anti-abortionist are becoming majority lately. Republicans often campaign on this issue, and often enact some minor laws on state level that more usually then not get overturned by Federal judges. Yet, despite obvious problem (Roe v. Wade) , Republicans never muster an effort to define unborn children as humans (let's say from seventh week of pregnancy) , therefore giving them legal protection from killing.
As we could see from this example, both Republicans and Democrats act like different cycles of same engine that pushes US in direction not necessarily in interest of its population, and their largely ceremonial confrontation sucks the oxygen from other political movements.
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
This is so-called two steps forward, one step back approach in controlling population
You create two at first glance bitterly opposed parties that seemingly oppose each other on number of important issues. One party comes to power and impose some unpopular law or issue. Other party rides on wave of popular indignation with the measure, but when finally after elections comes to power does little or nothing to change situation. Instead, it repeats the cycle with some other unpopular act, and cycle repeats itself.
Other parties and other issues (which could be very important, but two major parties agree on them) are ignored by mass media, so voters do not know about them .
Examples from real life :
Most Americans started opposing Iraq war in 2005. War was Republican endeavor, and led to rise of Democrats and Obama who portrayed themselves as doves. But when Democrats took power, they actually increased US military involment around the world, especially in Middle East (Libya, Syria etc ...)
Most Americans opposed homosexual marriage in 2009. It was Democrats measure to push it on whole country, with lot of Republicans bitterly opposing it. But when Republicans finally took power in 2017 they declared that "homosexual marriage is law of the land" and did nothing to overturn this decision.
Large number of Americans oppose abortion, especially late-term abortion . In fact anti-abortionist are becoming majority lately. Republicans often campaign on this issue, and often enact some minor laws on state level that more usually then not get overturned by Federal judges. Yet, despite obvious problem (Roe v. Wade) , Republicans never muster an effort to define unborn children as humans (let's say from seventh week of pregnancy) , therefore giving them legal protection from killing.
As we could see from this example, both Republicans and Democrats act like different cycles of same engine that pushes US in direction not necessarily in interest of its population, and their largely ceremonial confrontation sucks the oxygen from other political movements.
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
up vote
4
down vote
This is so-called two steps forward, one step back approach in controlling population
You create two at first glance bitterly opposed parties that seemingly oppose each other on number of important issues. One party comes to power and impose some unpopular law or issue. Other party rides on wave of popular indignation with the measure, but when finally after elections comes to power does little or nothing to change situation. Instead, it repeats the cycle with some other unpopular act, and cycle repeats itself.
Other parties and other issues (which could be very important, but two major parties agree on them) are ignored by mass media, so voters do not know about them .
Examples from real life :
Most Americans started opposing Iraq war in 2005. War was Republican endeavor, and led to rise of Democrats and Obama who portrayed themselves as doves. But when Democrats took power, they actually increased US military involment around the world, especially in Middle East (Libya, Syria etc ...)
Most Americans opposed homosexual marriage in 2009. It was Democrats measure to push it on whole country, with lot of Republicans bitterly opposing it. But when Republicans finally took power in 2017 they declared that "homosexual marriage is law of the land" and did nothing to overturn this decision.
Large number of Americans oppose abortion, especially late-term abortion . In fact anti-abortionist are becoming majority lately. Republicans often campaign on this issue, and often enact some minor laws on state level that more usually then not get overturned by Federal judges. Yet, despite obvious problem (Roe v. Wade) , Republicans never muster an effort to define unborn children as humans (let's say from seventh week of pregnancy) , therefore giving them legal protection from killing.
As we could see from this example, both Republicans and Democrats act like different cycles of same engine that pushes US in direction not necessarily in interest of its population, and their largely ceremonial confrontation sucks the oxygen from other political movements.
This is so-called two steps forward, one step back approach in controlling population
You create two at first glance bitterly opposed parties that seemingly oppose each other on number of important issues. One party comes to power and impose some unpopular law or issue. Other party rides on wave of popular indignation with the measure, but when finally after elections comes to power does little or nothing to change situation. Instead, it repeats the cycle with some other unpopular act, and cycle repeats itself.
Other parties and other issues (which could be very important, but two major parties agree on them) are ignored by mass media, so voters do not know about them .
Examples from real life :
Most Americans started opposing Iraq war in 2005. War was Republican endeavor, and led to rise of Democrats and Obama who portrayed themselves as doves. But when Democrats took power, they actually increased US military involment around the world, especially in Middle East (Libya, Syria etc ...)
Most Americans opposed homosexual marriage in 2009. It was Democrats measure to push it on whole country, with lot of Republicans bitterly opposing it. But when Republicans finally took power in 2017 they declared that "homosexual marriage is law of the land" and did nothing to overturn this decision.
Large number of Americans oppose abortion, especially late-term abortion . In fact anti-abortionist are becoming majority lately. Republicans often campaign on this issue, and often enact some minor laws on state level that more usually then not get overturned by Federal judges. Yet, despite obvious problem (Roe v. Wade) , Republicans never muster an effort to define unborn children as humans (let's say from seventh week of pregnancy) , therefore giving them legal protection from killing.
As we could see from this example, both Republicans and Democrats act like different cycles of same engine that pushes US in direction not necessarily in interest of its population, and their largely ceremonial confrontation sucks the oxygen from other political movements.
edited 23 hours ago
answered yesterday
rs.29
1,32019
1,32019
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
Walter Karp argued that US political parties form a virtual bipartisan oligarchy which colludes together for the primary purposes of mutual self-preservation and maintaining organizational power in his 1973 Indispensable Enemies: The Politics of Misrule in America.
The summary is rather weak. Have a copy, but haven't yet more than skimmed it...
â agc
yesterday
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
Walter Karp argued that US political parties form a virtual bipartisan oligarchy which colludes together for the primary purposes of mutual self-preservation and maintaining organizational power in his 1973 Indispensable Enemies: The Politics of Misrule in America.
The summary is rather weak. Have a copy, but haven't yet more than skimmed it...
â agc
yesterday
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
up vote
3
down vote
Walter Karp argued that US political parties form a virtual bipartisan oligarchy which colludes together for the primary purposes of mutual self-preservation and maintaining organizational power in his 1973 Indispensable Enemies: The Politics of Misrule in America.
Walter Karp argued that US political parties form a virtual bipartisan oligarchy which colludes together for the primary purposes of mutual self-preservation and maintaining organizational power in his 1973 Indispensable Enemies: The Politics of Misrule in America.
edited yesterday
answered yesterday
agc
3,2441241
3,2441241
The summary is rather weak. Have a copy, but haven't yet more than skimmed it...
â agc
yesterday
add a comment |Â
The summary is rather weak. Have a copy, but haven't yet more than skimmed it...
â agc
yesterday
The summary is rather weak. Have a copy, but haven't yet more than skimmed it...
â agc
yesterday
The summary is rather weak. Have a copy, but haven't yet more than skimmed it...
â agc
yesterday
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
They did when they had a common external enemy, and the world was better for it.
The United States fought the fascists during World War II (1941-1945), and the Soviet Union during the Cold War (1945-1991). During this period, the country faced a common external enemy, and Democrats and Republicans cooperated to unprecedented levels. Among the accomplishments:
- Willingness from both political parties to engage in foreign affairs, form alliances, and negotiate treaties and trade pacts.
- Serving as a political and economic superpower.
- Actively participate in the United Nations and NATO.
- Aiding other countries through the International Monetary Fund and World Bank, which helped the reconstruction of much of Europe and Japan after WWII.
- Development of the Interstate Highway system.
- Funding (or in some cases, directly pursuing) scientific research through the National Science Foundation, National Institutes of Health, Department of Energy, and DARPA.
- Through DARPA, funding the initial development of the Internet that you are now using.
- Providing funding for public elementary, secondary, and higher education.
- Providing stable government institutions. As much as Reagan talked about cutting government, in practice most agencies grew during his tenure.
- Enthusiastically operating a space program -- and most notably -- putting men on the moon.
After the fall of the Soviet Union, the enemy became each other. Democrats and Republicans turned on each other, in increasing rounds of tit-for-tat. Indeed, during the last 25 years we have seen the following:
- Paranoia that the United Nations is a world government which is controlling American politics.
- Using foreign countries as a scapegoat for job losses.
- Isolationism.
- Withdrawal from NATO, NAFTA, TPP, and other alliances and trade pacts.
- The loss of international respect and influence of the United States.
- Cutting foreign aid (particularly for "s---hole countries").
- Deteriorating infrastructure (e.g. collapsed roads and bridges, contaminated public water supplies). Refusing to repair or replace it because of a fear of taxes and government spending.
- Cutting scientific funding (e.g. Superconducting Supercollider).
- Mocking science as an "opinion" (e.g. evolution, climate change, endangered species).
- Refusing to regulate the monopolies that control much of the Internet.
- Cutting funding for public elementary, secondary, and higher education (mostly by state governments).
- Turning education over to for-profit corporations.
- Mocking (e.g. "Deep State"), defunding, and harassing government institutions.
- Allowing the space program to wither to the point where we use Russian rockets to send astronauts into space.
Since the question mentions "any two party system" (which I take to mean countries other than the US), you could expand your answer to include Britain during World War II as well, which saw unprecedented levels of bipartisan cooperation due to the Nazi threat.
â CJ Dennis
17 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
They did when they had a common external enemy, and the world was better for it.
The United States fought the fascists during World War II (1941-1945), and the Soviet Union during the Cold War (1945-1991). During this period, the country faced a common external enemy, and Democrats and Republicans cooperated to unprecedented levels. Among the accomplishments:
- Willingness from both political parties to engage in foreign affairs, form alliances, and negotiate treaties and trade pacts.
- Serving as a political and economic superpower.
- Actively participate in the United Nations and NATO.
- Aiding other countries through the International Monetary Fund and World Bank, which helped the reconstruction of much of Europe and Japan after WWII.
- Development of the Interstate Highway system.
- Funding (or in some cases, directly pursuing) scientific research through the National Science Foundation, National Institutes of Health, Department of Energy, and DARPA.
- Through DARPA, funding the initial development of the Internet that you are now using.
- Providing funding for public elementary, secondary, and higher education.
- Providing stable government institutions. As much as Reagan talked about cutting government, in practice most agencies grew during his tenure.
- Enthusiastically operating a space program -- and most notably -- putting men on the moon.
After the fall of the Soviet Union, the enemy became each other. Democrats and Republicans turned on each other, in increasing rounds of tit-for-tat. Indeed, during the last 25 years we have seen the following:
- Paranoia that the United Nations is a world government which is controlling American politics.
- Using foreign countries as a scapegoat for job losses.
- Isolationism.
- Withdrawal from NATO, NAFTA, TPP, and other alliances and trade pacts.
- The loss of international respect and influence of the United States.
- Cutting foreign aid (particularly for "s---hole countries").
- Deteriorating infrastructure (e.g. collapsed roads and bridges, contaminated public water supplies). Refusing to repair or replace it because of a fear of taxes and government spending.
- Cutting scientific funding (e.g. Superconducting Supercollider).
- Mocking science as an "opinion" (e.g. evolution, climate change, endangered species).
- Refusing to regulate the monopolies that control much of the Internet.
- Cutting funding for public elementary, secondary, and higher education (mostly by state governments).
- Turning education over to for-profit corporations.
- Mocking (e.g. "Deep State"), defunding, and harassing government institutions.
- Allowing the space program to wither to the point where we use Russian rockets to send astronauts into space.
Since the question mentions "any two party system" (which I take to mean countries other than the US), you could expand your answer to include Britain during World War II as well, which saw unprecedented levels of bipartisan cooperation due to the Nazi threat.
â CJ Dennis
17 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
up vote
2
down vote
They did when they had a common external enemy, and the world was better for it.
The United States fought the fascists during World War II (1941-1945), and the Soviet Union during the Cold War (1945-1991). During this period, the country faced a common external enemy, and Democrats and Republicans cooperated to unprecedented levels. Among the accomplishments:
- Willingness from both political parties to engage in foreign affairs, form alliances, and negotiate treaties and trade pacts.
- Serving as a political and economic superpower.
- Actively participate in the United Nations and NATO.
- Aiding other countries through the International Monetary Fund and World Bank, which helped the reconstruction of much of Europe and Japan after WWII.
- Development of the Interstate Highway system.
- Funding (or in some cases, directly pursuing) scientific research through the National Science Foundation, National Institutes of Health, Department of Energy, and DARPA.
- Through DARPA, funding the initial development of the Internet that you are now using.
- Providing funding for public elementary, secondary, and higher education.
- Providing stable government institutions. As much as Reagan talked about cutting government, in practice most agencies grew during his tenure.
- Enthusiastically operating a space program -- and most notably -- putting men on the moon.
After the fall of the Soviet Union, the enemy became each other. Democrats and Republicans turned on each other, in increasing rounds of tit-for-tat. Indeed, during the last 25 years we have seen the following:
- Paranoia that the United Nations is a world government which is controlling American politics.
- Using foreign countries as a scapegoat for job losses.
- Isolationism.
- Withdrawal from NATO, NAFTA, TPP, and other alliances and trade pacts.
- The loss of international respect and influence of the United States.
- Cutting foreign aid (particularly for "s---hole countries").
- Deteriorating infrastructure (e.g. collapsed roads and bridges, contaminated public water supplies). Refusing to repair or replace it because of a fear of taxes and government spending.
- Cutting scientific funding (e.g. Superconducting Supercollider).
- Mocking science as an "opinion" (e.g. evolution, climate change, endangered species).
- Refusing to regulate the monopolies that control much of the Internet.
- Cutting funding for public elementary, secondary, and higher education (mostly by state governments).
- Turning education over to for-profit corporations.
- Mocking (e.g. "Deep State"), defunding, and harassing government institutions.
- Allowing the space program to wither to the point where we use Russian rockets to send astronauts into space.
They did when they had a common external enemy, and the world was better for it.
The United States fought the fascists during World War II (1941-1945), and the Soviet Union during the Cold War (1945-1991). During this period, the country faced a common external enemy, and Democrats and Republicans cooperated to unprecedented levels. Among the accomplishments:
- Willingness from both political parties to engage in foreign affairs, form alliances, and negotiate treaties and trade pacts.
- Serving as a political and economic superpower.
- Actively participate in the United Nations and NATO.
- Aiding other countries through the International Monetary Fund and World Bank, which helped the reconstruction of much of Europe and Japan after WWII.
- Development of the Interstate Highway system.
- Funding (or in some cases, directly pursuing) scientific research through the National Science Foundation, National Institutes of Health, Department of Energy, and DARPA.
- Through DARPA, funding the initial development of the Internet that you are now using.
- Providing funding for public elementary, secondary, and higher education.
- Providing stable government institutions. As much as Reagan talked about cutting government, in practice most agencies grew during his tenure.
- Enthusiastically operating a space program -- and most notably -- putting men on the moon.
After the fall of the Soviet Union, the enemy became each other. Democrats and Republicans turned on each other, in increasing rounds of tit-for-tat. Indeed, during the last 25 years we have seen the following:
- Paranoia that the United Nations is a world government which is controlling American politics.
- Using foreign countries as a scapegoat for job losses.
- Isolationism.
- Withdrawal from NATO, NAFTA, TPP, and other alliances and trade pacts.
- The loss of international respect and influence of the United States.
- Cutting foreign aid (particularly for "s---hole countries").
- Deteriorating infrastructure (e.g. collapsed roads and bridges, contaminated public water supplies). Refusing to repair or replace it because of a fear of taxes and government spending.
- Cutting scientific funding (e.g. Superconducting Supercollider).
- Mocking science as an "opinion" (e.g. evolution, climate change, endangered species).
- Refusing to regulate the monopolies that control much of the Internet.
- Cutting funding for public elementary, secondary, and higher education (mostly by state governments).
- Turning education over to for-profit corporations.
- Mocking (e.g. "Deep State"), defunding, and harassing government institutions.
- Allowing the space program to wither to the point where we use Russian rockets to send astronauts into space.
answered yesterday
Dr Sheldon
1213
1213
Since the question mentions "any two party system" (which I take to mean countries other than the US), you could expand your answer to include Britain during World War II as well, which saw unprecedented levels of bipartisan cooperation due to the Nazi threat.
â CJ Dennis
17 hours ago
add a comment |Â
Since the question mentions "any two party system" (which I take to mean countries other than the US), you could expand your answer to include Britain during World War II as well, which saw unprecedented levels of bipartisan cooperation due to the Nazi threat.
â CJ Dennis
17 hours ago
Since the question mentions "any two party system" (which I take to mean countries other than the US), you could expand your answer to include Britain during World War II as well, which saw unprecedented levels of bipartisan cooperation due to the Nazi threat.
â CJ Dennis
17 hours ago
Since the question mentions "any two party system" (which I take to mean countries other than the US), you could expand your answer to include Britain during World War II as well, which saw unprecedented levels of bipartisan cooperation due to the Nazi threat.
â CJ Dennis
17 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
-5
down vote
They kind of do, in an effort to swing the country further right and enable corruption. RomneyCare/ObamaCare was originally written by GOP thinktanks and insurance companies to appease democrats and prevent a swing towards universal healthcare. The democrats, who work for the same people, coopted and took ownership of the plan, establishing it as a progressive/left position and enabling both parties to effectively block universal healthcare in about the same way while appearing to their bases to be representing opposite sides.
You can find similar examples in union busting, banking deregulation, elimination of anti-trust enforcement, etc. They work towards the same goals while giving the appearance of fighting, a carefully choreographed dance for their mutual financial supporters.
3
Can you back up your answer? Answers without references tend to be downvoted and/or removed.
â Alexei
2 days ago
This does not provide an answer to the question. To critique or request clarification from an author, leave a comment below their post. - From Review
â nelruk
18 hours ago
Seems to me that by saying the same thing as several others, either this is an answer or most of the others aren't.
â WGroleau
3 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
-5
down vote
They kind of do, in an effort to swing the country further right and enable corruption. RomneyCare/ObamaCare was originally written by GOP thinktanks and insurance companies to appease democrats and prevent a swing towards universal healthcare. The democrats, who work for the same people, coopted and took ownership of the plan, establishing it as a progressive/left position and enabling both parties to effectively block universal healthcare in about the same way while appearing to their bases to be representing opposite sides.
You can find similar examples in union busting, banking deregulation, elimination of anti-trust enforcement, etc. They work towards the same goals while giving the appearance of fighting, a carefully choreographed dance for their mutual financial supporters.
3
Can you back up your answer? Answers without references tend to be downvoted and/or removed.
â Alexei
2 days ago
This does not provide an answer to the question. To critique or request clarification from an author, leave a comment below their post. - From Review
â nelruk
18 hours ago
Seems to me that by saying the same thing as several others, either this is an answer or most of the others aren't.
â WGroleau
3 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
-5
down vote
up vote
-5
down vote
They kind of do, in an effort to swing the country further right and enable corruption. RomneyCare/ObamaCare was originally written by GOP thinktanks and insurance companies to appease democrats and prevent a swing towards universal healthcare. The democrats, who work for the same people, coopted and took ownership of the plan, establishing it as a progressive/left position and enabling both parties to effectively block universal healthcare in about the same way while appearing to their bases to be representing opposite sides.
You can find similar examples in union busting, banking deregulation, elimination of anti-trust enforcement, etc. They work towards the same goals while giving the appearance of fighting, a carefully choreographed dance for their mutual financial supporters.
They kind of do, in an effort to swing the country further right and enable corruption. RomneyCare/ObamaCare was originally written by GOP thinktanks and insurance companies to appease democrats and prevent a swing towards universal healthcare. The democrats, who work for the same people, coopted and took ownership of the plan, establishing it as a progressive/left position and enabling both parties to effectively block universal healthcare in about the same way while appearing to their bases to be representing opposite sides.
You can find similar examples in union busting, banking deregulation, elimination of anti-trust enforcement, etc. They work towards the same goals while giving the appearance of fighting, a carefully choreographed dance for their mutual financial supporters.
answered 2 days ago
Jay Speidell
107
107
3
Can you back up your answer? Answers without references tend to be downvoted and/or removed.
â Alexei
2 days ago
This does not provide an answer to the question. To critique or request clarification from an author, leave a comment below their post. - From Review
â nelruk
18 hours ago
Seems to me that by saying the same thing as several others, either this is an answer or most of the others aren't.
â WGroleau
3 hours ago
add a comment |Â
3
Can you back up your answer? Answers without references tend to be downvoted and/or removed.
â Alexei
2 days ago
This does not provide an answer to the question. To critique or request clarification from an author, leave a comment below their post. - From Review
â nelruk
18 hours ago
Seems to me that by saying the same thing as several others, either this is an answer or most of the others aren't.
â WGroleau
3 hours ago
3
3
Can you back up your answer? Answers without references tend to be downvoted and/or removed.
â Alexei
2 days ago
Can you back up your answer? Answers without references tend to be downvoted and/or removed.
â Alexei
2 days ago
This does not provide an answer to the question. To critique or request clarification from an author, leave a comment below their post. - From Review
â nelruk
18 hours ago
This does not provide an answer to the question. To critique or request clarification from an author, leave a comment below their post. - From Review
â nelruk
18 hours ago
Seems to me that by saying the same thing as several others, either this is an answer or most of the others aren't.
â WGroleau
3 hours ago
Seems to me that by saying the same thing as several others, either this is an answer or most of the others aren't.
â WGroleau
3 hours ago
add a comment |Â
protected by Philipp⦠21 hours ago
Thank you for your interest in this question.
Because it has attracted low-quality or spam answers that had to be removed, posting an answer now requires 10 reputation on this site (the association bonus does not count).
Would you like to answer one of these unanswered questions instead?
10
How do you wish "collude" to be interpreted? E.g. there are several states with election laws which treat the major parties differently from other parties and individuals. Does that count as collusion, or does it need to be less accidental than that?
â origimbo
2 days ago
33
What do you mean by "total and perpetual dominance of the country"? Those two political parties have dominated Congress and the Presidency for well over a century, so it seems like their job is already done. Are you more asking why they don't work together to pass legislation that outright makes other parties illegal?
â Giter
2 days ago
5
Why would they need to? It is already locked into a two party system with them in control for the most part
â Joe W
2 days ago
7
How do you know they're not colluding? In fact both parties have recently had major campaigns by anti-establishment candidates (Sanders (D) and Trump (R)) that were largely premised on the claim that the elected officials of both parties ("the establishment") were in fact in cahoots.
â Joe
2 days ago
11
They do. Most bills are passed with bipartisan and often unanimous support, although a modest subset are partisan and/or controversial. Democrats and Republicans combined have had total control of the country since the late 19th century.
â ohwilleke
2 days ago